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...and still a 1st for my cars: Not a frozen starter, but instead a frozen fan!!! I had about 3 inches of ICE in my pulley cover. The ice was frozen to the pulley cover and the outer fan! That is why the whole car shook when I tried to start it. A little warm, not hot, water and about 30 seconds and it started right up. -- Brian-- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/8328/ ------------------------------------------------------------------- Too much? Digest! mailto:type3-d-request@vwtype3.org Subj=subscribe