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I have lost 2 sets of quiet packs installed by POs. One was with the extra hanger, one without. Both split in the middle around the circumferece as well. After loosing the second one, I ripped it apart to look at it. The metal is soooo thin, it doesn't stand much of a chance! If you need performance and less back pressure, but still want heat, open up the exit on a stock muffler and run a 1.5 inch outlet pipe! I am working on this conversion right now to rid my Fasty of the 4 tip POP (Piece o Poop) that was installed. -- Brian-- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/8328/ ------------------------------------------------------------------- Pitch in! Send your pledge of support! mailto:support@vwtype3.org