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Toby, what kind of welding rods are ng? If it's all stainless you need stainless rods. You might also want to try a smaller diameter rod. I always have better luck with a small rod, unless I am filling up a big gap. Of course wire is the only way to go. Walmart has a small one for about 150. does a fair job on thin stuff William 73 squareback ------------------------------------------------------------------- List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list or mailto:help@vwtype3.org