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it's been a busy vw day at my house! first the good news, then the questions, i took some advice and got some carb cleaner. i had changed the head manifold carb gaskets so i was look ing for help when i sprayed the heads nothing happened, but when i sprayed the carb base the idle dropped just a little, so i think hmmm guess i'll change that gasket again, and i started to clean off the rest of the carb before removal when the idle dropped sharply, then died, so i startpokeing around the carb and find the idle cut off switch a little wiggly. damn! tightened it down adjusted the idle down a little now i can't make it die if i try. then i was so happy i ripped the distributor right out of my square back, cleaned it off and found lots of numbers underneath the grime.!! they are: JFURX4 ( bosch) 0 231 163 016 vw 311 905 205 AD so now can some one tell me where to set my timing, please i'm going outside now to praise the gods of gumout ------------------------------------------------------------------- List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list or mailto:help@vwtype3.org