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type3-d-request@vwtype3.org wrote:
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type3-d Digest Volume 2006 : Issue 96
Today's Topics:
RE: [T3] FI vs Carburetion. [ Philip Seeger <alaskaparadise@sbcgl ]
[T3] 68 Fastback FI (?) Issues - Dia [ Matthew Jones <m@vw1600e.org.uk> ]
[T3] FI rich mix cyl. 2 & 3 only, po [ "Will McCreight" <whmcc@attglobal.n ]
[T3] Possible Scammer? [ Chris Wright <Christopher.Wright@Su ]
Re: [T3] FI vs Carburetion. [ Steven Ayres <comwest@att.net> ]
Re: [T3] 68 Fastback FI (?) Issues - [ "Dave Hall" <dave@hallvw.clara.co.u ]
[T3] 68 Fastback FI (?) Issues - Dia [ cwo4smith@comcast.net ]
RE: [T3] Possible Scammer? [ "Keith Park" <topnotch@nycap.rr.com ]
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Subject: RE: [T3] FI vs Carburetion. From: Philip Seeger <alaskaparadise@sbcglobal.net> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2006 20:31:48 -0800 (PST) To: type3@vwtype3.org
I would really like to purchase the two books you said you may have. Is the Bently color copies you have in new condition and how much?
Thanks for the reply
--- Jim Adney <jadney@vwtype3.org> wrote:
On 27 Mar 2006 at 8:32, Seeger, Philip F PWR wrote:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Is there a good book or manual for FI?
The book you must buy first for any type 3 is the Bentley manual:
Volkswagen Official Service Manual Type 3 Fastback and Squareback 1968-1973 published by Robert Bentley, Cambridge, Mass, 1974 ISBN 0-8376-0057-X / LPV 997 383 / VSQU (excellent book, complete and well written)
If you want info on earlier years and on the stock
carbs, then you should also buy:
VW 1500 & 1600 Type 3, 1963 thru 1973, Haynes 084 (US) by J H Haynes and D H Stead published by Haynes North America, Inc, 1974, 1987, 1989, 1993 ISBN 0-900550-84-8
These 2 books are still in print, although the
Bentley printings dropped the color wiring diagrams about 15 years
ago. Old copies can still be found and I have a few available for sale.
For the FI the best book out there is long out of
print, but it still shows up occasionally. I think I may have one of
these available. There were 4 different editions, the last one is the
largest and most complete, but the first one is fine for 68-9 owners.
Volkswagen Fuel Injection Technical Manual, forth edition (covers D-Jetronic VW Type IIIs, IVs, & Porsche 914/4s) published by Henry Elfrink, Los Angeles, 1972
-- ******************************* Jim Adney, jadney@vwtype3.org Madison, Wisconsin, USA *******************************
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org
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Subject: [T3] 68 Fastback FI (?) Issues - Diagnostic Help Requested From: Matthew Jones <m@vw1600e.org.uk> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 09:50:33 +0100 To: "type3@vwtype3.org" <type3@vwtype3.org>
I pull off the VR that was installed in the car and put in
the "new" Bosch
unit, making sure all wires were on the correct connectors.
It was a bit of
tight fit against the heater channel, but there was no risk
of shorting the
connection and the thick card stock that folds up over the VR
is still in
place.
<snip>
Some general comments: I've suffered several dead VRs on my FI (all old parts). My symptoms were good idle when everything's running off the battery. As soon as you pick up the revs and get onto the VR, you see badly regulated volts (fluctuating, peaks as high as 17v), and the brain can't deal with it, leading to almost undrivably bad running. This can all be observed without actually driving the car - put the voltmeter on the 12v terminal of the coil to see the regulator output, while you pull the throttle cable by hand.
New Mexican solid state Bosch VR works fine for me. You've already spotted that the case is D+. My writeup : http://vw1600e.org.uk/regulator/
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Subject: [T3] FI rich mix cyl. 2 & 3 only, poor mpg (11 mpg) From: "Will McCreight" <whmcc@attglobal.net> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 03:04:41 -0800 To: <type3@vwtype3.org>
Still working on a sick 1970 squareback...new points/plugs/plug wires, checked all injectors, replaced fuel rail, checked sensors, fuel line pressure, timing, dwell, generator voltage, new voltage regulator.
Today, pulled plugs to check compression only to find plugs 2 & 3 to be entirely black, 3 dry/fluffy, 2 slightly wet/oily but just a much carbon as 3, 1 & 4 look just right...and this after only about one or two tankfuls of gas since new plugs. Compression all within 110-120 range, warm w/o plugs & throttle open, 7-8 cranks. Didn't squirt teaspoon of oil to check rings cause looked OK dry.
So, my question is now directed at either the brain, the fuel injector trigger contacts, or some other wiring or lead which would affect one set of injectors (2 & 3) but not the others (1 & 4), since they fire in pairs per the computer/contacts setup.
I've not run all the wiring from the brain, but one prior major factor to consider is that this car ran for a long time with a broken wire at injector 3 (ran very rough...is my daughter's car which she limped along at college) prior to my taking on "the project" three weeks ago...my first hands-on engine dx/rx, and having fun, learning lots! Injector 3 had a split plastic end cap at its tip, which stuck in the inlet along with its rubber gasket, and had to be removed via mirror and hemostat. A new injector now resides there.
Any thoughts? I will be checking valve lash tomorrow. Also, once "fixed", do I need to do anything special to burn away the carbon deposits which I am imagining now reside in those two cylinders?
Thanx on advance.
Will McCreight whmcc@attglobal.net
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List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org
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Subject:
[T3] Possible Scammer?
From:
Chris Wright <Christopher.Wright@Sun.COM>
Date:
Tue, 28 Mar 2006 15:25:57 +0100
To:
Type 34 Registry Mailing List <T34@type34.org>, everettb@thesamba.com, T3 List <type3@vwtype3.org>
Last October I bought a NOS muffler on The Samba from Billy Dobbs, alias lowfatbug@yahoo.com at the VdubHobby Shop, Mckinney, Texas.
I sent him the cash including shipping (Total $185 if I remember correctly) and he confirmed receipt. He then went quiet for a week or so, and when I chased, he confirmed shipping by sea mail as agreed. In February I contacted him and he gave a story of the shipping company having a fired employee who ripped the labels off the packing of some parcels. Since then he has not replied to my mails. I mailed him a week ago warning that I would report this on The Samba and the T34 and T3 lists if he didn't respond within a week. No response, which doubles my suspicions. You can draw your own conclusions as to whether this is a scam or just an unfortunate shipping loss.
Everett, is there some kind of feedback rating on The Samba that can be used for registering this unfortunate transaction?
Chris **
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Subject: Re: [T3] FI vs Carburetion. From: Steven Ayres <comwest@att.net> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 08:33:27 -0700 To: type3@vwtype3.org
PhilipS=> With all the bad press about FI problems, I am thinking of converting to carburetion.
At the risk of creating an echo chamber, I'll chime in that the 'bad press' is really just persistent ignorant rumor. What I can add is my perspective as a carb guy.
The VW world is full of people with very narrow mechanical skills that they trust implicitly, and the Muir-book culture tends to reinforce them. Muir was a cool dude and knew a lot about early Type 2s, but he was not a Type 3 guy. Contrary to what many Type 1 mechanics imagine, Type 3s are different.
While I think 'vastly superior' is overstatement, it's true that the D-jet FI system is reliable, easy to use and just about bulletproof, and offers good performance across the stock range. Any conversion from a stock system, including tricking out a stock carb system, requires real engineering study and know-how, and entails a fair amount of expense and hassle.
I'll also agree that your displacement idea is ambitious. Speaking also as a mildly-built-motor guy, I'd advise you to first get your stock systems up to spec and working right, including less obvious performance factors like the suspension, see how you like the car's stock performance, *then* decide whether you really want to deal with performance upgrades. Again, this is *not* a Beetle and the difference in performance is substantial.
Steven Ayres, Prescott AZ '66 KG1600
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Subject: Re: [T3] 68 Fastback FI (?) Issues - Diagnostic Help Requested From: "Dave Hall" <dave@hallvw.clara.co.uk> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2006 23:44:33 +0100 To: <type3@vwtype3.org>
It wouldn't be the first time a meter read wrongly. My son was measuring his car's alternator output, and it showed about 16V on his digital multimeter, so he assumed the regulator diodes had gone and got another pack, only to find it made no difference. I checked the voltage with my meter and it only showed 12V.
Of course, if he had told me his battery wasn't charging and the voltage output was 16V, I'd have smelled a rat!
Try measuring the battery only - engine stopped - and see if it reads about 12 - 13V, or more.
Dave. UK VW Type 3 & 4 Club http://www.hallvw.clara.co.uk/ ------
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List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org
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Subject: [T3] 68 Fastback FI (?) Issues - Diagnostic Help Requested From: cwo4smith@comcast.net Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2006 00:11:47 +0000 To: type3@vwtype3.org
Dave - I just checked - car turned off - voltmeter on battery shows 12V
Mike
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List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org
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Subject: RE: [T3] Possible Scammer? From: "Keith Park" <topnotch@nycap.rr.com> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 19:41:15 -0500 To: <type3@vwtype3.org>
Ive never heard of the seller but I have NOS German T3 mufflers in stock for $125, and nobody ever seems interested. I guess I really need to post some stuff on the Samba, I know it's the best sight on the net for general AC VW, but I really need to make a note of hopping over there more often.
Keith
Top Notch Restorations
topnotch@nycap.rr.com 71 Squareback
65 Notchback "El Baja Rojo"
65 Squareback "Eggcrate"
87 golf "Winterat"
93 RX7 "Redstur"
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Wright [mailto:Christopher.Wright@Sun.COM] Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2006 9:26 AM
To: Type 34 Registry Mailing List; everettb@thesamba.com; T3 List
Subject: [T3] Possible Scammer?
Last October I bought a NOS muffler on The Samba from Billy Dobbs, alias lowfatbug@yahoo.com at the VdubHobby Shop, Mckinney, Texas.
I sent him the cash including shipping (Total $185 if I remember correctly) and he confirmed receipt. He then went quiet for a week or so, and when I chased, he confirmed shipping by sea mail as agreed. In February I contacted him and he gave a story of the shipping company having a fired employee who ripped the labels off the packing of some parcels. Since then he has not replied to my mails. I mailed him a week ago warning that I would report this on The Samba and the T34 and T3 lists if he didn't respond within a week. No response, which doubles my suspicions. You can draw your own conclusions as to whether this is a scam or just an unfortunate shipping loss.
Everett, is there some kind of feedback rating on The Samba that can be used for registering this unfortunate transaction?
Chris **
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~