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>Its like if i don't start the car on the first two tries it gives up. Do you have a non-stock battery clamp - aluminium maybe? I felt an idiot years ago when I fell foul of electrolytic action between aluminium and lead. It oxidixed very rapidly. Check your head-lights come on. That would rule out corrosion in the battery leads. Dave. UK VW Type 3&4 Club http://www.hallvw.clara.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------- List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list or mailto:help@vwtype3.org