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Re: [T3] Purest Type 3 group? (lowering)

> 3 Notches in front will bring you into about -2 degrees of Caster... this
> opposite the +4 you want, so the car will wander severly in high winds and
> bump steer on uneven pavement. If its smooth and Calm you wont notice this
> as much.

Maybe in books and on paper, but I didn't have any problems with it in real
life at obviously high rates of speed.

> I always wonder how people say this 2 or 3 notches in the Front... 1 Notch
> ~12 degrees which puts you bar right next to the bump stop, 2 and you may
> just be able to get it on without removing the suspension stops.
> 2 notches down is 0 to -1 degress of caster... unstable.

I commonly went 2 or 3 notches with no problems. For 3 I would remove the
original bump stop and bump stop mount (the little nub and washer/spacer
looking thing) completely. I would then add a small poly bump stop onto the
horn that held the original bump stop.
Could your 12 degree figure be off? (just asking, I have no idea.)

> Again... 36 degrees change in bar and how in the world do you even get it
> in??  It would be resting firmly on the lower stop even if you could.

Try it and see. It is done all the time. I don't recall it being difficult
at all. Again, maybe your 12 degree figure is off.

> Because the shock is absorbed slowly if the torsion bar is allowed to
> it as it was designed.  If you slam the arm into the bump stop it slams
> arm against the needle bearing and bushing, and the needles actually stamp
> themselves into the race on the arm, causing quick wear from then on.
> front end on every lowered car Ive seen has been shot.

That's because they didn't allow for adequate suspension travel with decent
shocks. Other wise known as a "hack job".

> OK, youve really got to help me here, there are only 2 ways to lower,
> the lower torsion bars or dropped spindles and since there are so few
> dropped spindles out there I think your referring to the bars.
> your variable is How much do you lower?  Please give me a better
> understanding of what you mean about a properly adjusted and set up
> job.

I simply mean making sure it has enough suspension travel to allow the
shocks to absorb the bump and return. On our track car we re-located the
shock mounts to provide plenty of travel for the suspension to work.

> Again, a smooth highway on a clam day and your fine.  I drove the Purple
> Passion and was very happy with how smooth it was, till I hit a seam in
> pavement on the off ramp.  Maybe Im just sensitized to poor highways with
> all the potholes and heaving we have here in the Northeast in the winter,
> our highways are much worse than in the West.

Possibly, but I drove a lowered T3 for 4-5 years and I'm sure I came across
a bumpy and/or windy road in that amount of time.

> Ill have a spare Front beam with me in Hershey this summer, I invite all
> add thier ideas  to the front end presentation, and I will in fact show
> how to lower... so Im always interested to learn how
> others are getting by with what seems physical limitations to me.

Sorry, I won't be making it to Hershey.
This is strange, you say you can't see how we lower a car 3 measily notches
and you are going to "show us how to lower"?

I've gone as much as 6 notches and still managed to get the suspension back
together. I don't recommend trying this as it was a trailered only show car,
I also had to replace the upper ball-joints when I raised it to 3f/2r
because they were worn out from being stretched so badly. It had at most 300
miles on it. I drove it to the last show I took it to still at 6/3. It was a
1.5 hour trip one way.

I've driven with good results on 3+ notches in front with minor

-Patrick D.

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