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Here's some pics of a '64 Notch that I always thought was an "N", but now I'm not certain. <http://www.neil.us/type3/64notch/> The pictures are sort of crappy. I need to get over to this guy's lot again and get some more. He offered the car to me for $350, and maybe I'll end up buying it. The "N" stuff: Has the prop rods in front and back for the hoods No side markers Painted rear reflector housings Clock block off Absence of body molding Non "N" stuff: dual carb engine lock on passenger side door So what's the deal? Neil > Instead of upper door trim the door panel has vinyl to look like the upper > trim. > humm.... > Should have stuff like this. http://thesamba.com/vw/gallery/index.mv?search+What%20makes%20a%20N%20a%20N+ exact jason ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ List info at http://www.vwtype3.org/list | mailto:gregm@vwtype3.org